Chicken manure compost

[Mackeybear]

Good morning, all

I'm cleaning out my chicken houses and will probably end up with 500 pounds

of chicken manure and straw mixture. I'm wanting to compost this mess to

use on my two 20x20 gardens (at which I am also a relative novice). Should

have started the research months ago, but, of couse, I didn't. I would

greatly appreciate a simple compost or "tea" recipe or two. If it can be done

out on the ground rather than in some type of container, so much the better.

Also, should I till it in, or lay it on top of the soil around the seeds? If any of

you all know of a good simple chicken manure compost website, that would

be wonderful. We live just north of the northern Oklahoma border, so I plan

to be planting real soon. Thanks for the advice and good luck to us all this

summer.

Mackeybear

P.S. If I should have continued another thread rather than starting a new

one, please let me know. I'd like to make this as uncomplicated for you all

as possible, especially since I'm asking for your help.

[Mackeybear]

I also have several hundred pounds of oak leaves from last fall. Should I mix

in some of the chicken manure mixture and add water?? Any idea how I might

speed up the process if this could work? Again, my apologies for acting like a

total greenhorn, here. I just let spring sneak up on me this year.

Thanks and blessings

Mackeybear

[Big Dave]

To make good Humas you need equl amounts of green and brown. Green being grass clippings, veggie scraps ect... Brown being dryed grass, leaves tree bark from cuting wood ect... Now to activate you need the manure horse, cattle, chicken. That manure is what stars to make things heat up. Want to see get a thermometer and it should get to about 120 degees in the center of your pile. That heat is what causes seeds and bad stuff to die. If you have too much manure just let it dry out beside your compost. Add as it dries to your pile and you get more green and brown. I use chicken poo and oak leaves because that is what I have. I let it set a year before I add it to the garden. Some tell me it makes the soil acidic. I just eat my veggies and go on.

[Mid Tn Mama]

I'd add your chicken poo as side dressing to your plants. Just a litttle shovelful when you would normally fertilize. I wouldn't till it in now because it may still be uncomposted.

Here's what I do: I put leaves and junk mail in my coop instead of straw. That way there's "browns" to go with those "greens"(manure). Every few months I harvest a couple buckets of completely composted chicken manure that won't be too strong for the plants. Good luck.

[Paquebot]

Originally Posted by Mackeybear

I also have several hundred pounds of oak leaves from last fall. Should I mix

in some of the chicken manure mixture and add water??

Yes, add chicken manure to those oak leaves. Wouldn't need much manure to begin converting that mix to good compost. If you have 200 pounds of leaves, you'd only need about 20 pounds of fresh manure and a bit of water to have it go through a composting cycle. If it's not too fresh or wet, you could mix in up to 50 pounds without having it become anaerobic. And you only want it slightly damp, not wet.

To speed the process, reduce the leaves down to small bits if possible. Easiest way is with a bagging mower. If you're stuck with whole leaves and no way to shred them, they'll still break down but just take longer. Turning the pile every few days will also speed things by supply needed oxygen to the bacteria.

Martin

[cssc]

I thought oak leaves were bad for compost??

[Paquebot]

Originally Posted by cssc

I thought oak leaves were bad for compost??

Stop thinking!

Martin

[oldgaredneck]

Black walnut leaves are bad for compost, but any other leaves can be used with no problems!

[Jennifer Brewer]

Oak leaves *tend* to add a small amount of acidity to the soil (as do pine needles). If you live somewhere (like Kansas City or most of Missourri ) where your bedrock is limestone, or if you are planting near a concrete foundation, your soil is likely to be more on the alkaline side so the oak is fine. Also, if you are growing blueberries, heathes or heathers, azaleas or rhodedendrons, or blue hydrangeas, or primroses then mulching with oak compost and pine needles is very helpful, because those plants prefer a little acidity.

[veggrower]

Mix in a lot of chix manure with the oak leaves. I don't see how using more than just 50lbs of manure could make it 'anerobic'. What determines aerobic/anerobic is the presence of oxygen. Turning occasionally to keep air in the pile will keep it aerobic.

[Tricky Grama]

Compost tea is made by putting compost in a 'tea bag'-I use a pantyhose leg-& filling a 5# or more bucket w/H2O & dipping it in for maybe 5 days or so. Just let it sit & dip it up & down whenever you think about it. Then you can dilute that & use it to water the garden. I'd say dilute about 10 to 1.

Patty

[Paquebot]

Originally Posted by veggrower

Mix in a lot of chix manure with the oak leaves. I don't see how using more than just 50lbs of manure could make it 'anerobic'. What determines aerobic/anerobic is the presence of oxygen. Turning occasionally to keep air in the pile will keep it aerobic.

Ideal compost mix is 20 parts carbon to 1 part nitrogen. 200 pounds of carbon, the oak leaves, would need only 10 pounds of nitrogen, the chicken manure. 200 pounds of leaves plus 50 pounds of manure make it a 4 to 1 ratio. Such a mix could become anaerobic due to the presence of too much free ammonia which in turn kills off the desired bacteria needed for proper decomposition.

Martin

[Paquebot]

Originally Posted by veggrower

Based on making tens of thousands of yards of compost myself, she could mix all of gthe chix manure in and it would be stay aerobic. Some things ya gottoa do not just read out of a book.

Thus it wouldn't do any good to suggest J.I.Rodale's "The Complete Book of Composting"? Hasn't been any books come along yet to dispute what he started over 50 years ago. It's a little late now to be saying that he didn't know anything about making compost! Everything related to composting that applied then still applies today.

Martin

[Pony]

Yeah, there's great wisdom and loads of good info in books, but sometimes, you gotta go, "Whatever" and use what you have.

Keep it stirred, keep it moist but not wet, eventually it all breaks down.

As long as you're within certain margins, compost can be incredibly forgiving.

I just wouldn't do anything like dump fresh chicken poop on plants, things like that. A little common sense goes a long way.

Pony!

Spread the chicken manure and straw mixture on the bare ground, till it in, plant in about a month, spread the leaves on top of the ground as mulch to retain soil moisture and help suppress weed growth. Much less work with a pitchfork and less moving everything hither and yon.

I just cleaned out my henhouse and spread the mixed manure/litter on the garden and tilled it under. Watered it well to get it going (soil was nearly dust dry). I'll plant the first weekend in April. Mulch will go down shortly thereafter.

I like to compost in place. Ruth Stout knew what she was about.

.....Alan.

[turtlehead]

I have never worried about greens or browns. I just pile up whatever I have and when it gets too big I turn it over to a new spot and start a new pile. It eventually makes nice compost. If you pay attention to green/brown balance you'll have a hotter pile and you'll get compost a lot quicker, but I don't bother.

A.T. is really brave; I'd be too nervous to put chicken manure straight into the garden. But then I don't till, I use beds and just cultivate the top of the bed. If you're going to till, A.T. has a great point about moving things hither and yon. I'm all about less work

[Paquebot]

Pity poor Mackeybear! Comes here wanting to make compost and most are advising against it? When recipes are offered, they are disputed without producing an alternate recipe. Could it mean that everyone wants Mackeybear to fail or suffer a disastrous gardening season? Sure sounds that way when we have so many advising going against the known "rules"!

I'm rather proud of having composted in the same exact spot continuously since 10 July 1963. Piles or tumbler or, as now, both. Two days ago, tumbler was a sodden mess due to a winter's accumulation of kitchen scraps that were mixed in as soon as the contents were thawed enough to permit turning it. With 15 gallons of pure loft droppings also in the mix, it was rather stinky 2 days ago with a very strong ammonia smell. Definitely not an aerobic condition. Smelled more like a wet pile of chicken manure! 25 gallons of shredded oak and maple leaves were dumped in and thoroughly mixed. There were still some large chunks of frozen material circulating around as well. Less than 48 hours later, core temperature is 160ºF and smells like working compost should smell like. Now the excess moisture will be vented off as steam and it will all lead back to compost.

One thing that all composters eventually learn is that it's almost impossible to start with the ultimate mix. Most start a batch or pile with whatever is available despite it not being anywhere near a proper C:N ratio. After that, it becomes a game of correcting the mix. If it remains cold from too much brown material, then green matter is added as fuel to make it heat. If it's soggy and strong smelling from anaerobic rotting, then brown material is needed to bring it back to an aerobic condition. Use your nose to tell you what's happening with any mix. If it's a "neutral" earthy smell, you have a good aerobic bacteria action going. If it smells like a urinal from so much escaping ammonia, you have an anaerobic rotting condition taking place.

Martin

[veggrower]

I've read Rodale's composting--excellant book. I have also personally made over 30,000 cu yds of finished compost over the last 30 years. What do you make in a year martin?..2 yards?

Mackeybear isn't going to fail or have a disasterous garden if she builds a compost pile out of all of her leaves and all of her chix manure/beding mix. It won't go anaerobic from too much chix manure. I have built many, many piles out of pure chix manure w bedding--never went anerobic, many form pure grass clippings never went anaerobic UNLESS they becaume waterlogged by heavy rains.

You seem to be one of those people who only reads books and then does exactly what the book says. News flash: garden writers aren't always right Your information is very conservative and no doubt will work, but it is not the only right way nor even the best way.

Using your "rules" how is it possible that I can buy composted chix manure that is aerobically composted when they don't cut it with any 'brown'? I do, in fact buy several tons of it every year from a company that haas been aerobically composting chix manure straight from the broiler barns for over 30 years. They don't mix it with anything else and it stays aerobic. It is only mixed with the sawdust litter used in the broiler barns. It is a great product. WSDA and OMRI listed.

I visit their plant every year and get a quick tour from the owner. It is straight poop/litter composted under cover, lots of ammonia, smells like a diaper pail and the piles are hot.

Seriously, ya gotta get over yourself. Your way works but it isn't the only or the best way by far. You should try doing something other than what a book says--that is where the real learning comes from--allowing yourself to make a mistake.

[Paquebot]

Mackeybear, it looks like what you consider to be a mess really isn't a mess and that it must be a lot better than you describe. You apparently don't want to make compost from the combination of chicken manure, straw, and oak leaves. Instead, you are to use it "as is" with no further action on your part since there's nothing that you can do to turn it into something other than it is now. Especially since I still haven't seen any recipe or instructions given here. Lots of "ifs". "If" my aunts were males, they'd be my uncles!

Anaerobic decomposition IS mentioned in Rodale's book and it's possible under one condition which doesn't apply here.

Martin

[Paquebot]

I'm not alone in my suggested ignorance. Other's also blindly follow those who have gone ahead of us as caretakers of our soil. Maybe these people are all wrong? I don't think so!
http://forums2.gardenweb.com/forums/soil/
http://www.dirtdoctor.com/forum/archive.php/

Martin