Dexters are tough.
 

My oldest cow had a surprise for me this morning. A perfectly healthy dried off nursing heifer calf. I thought she had been a few weeks away from delivery so she delivered outdoors during the night instead of in the barn.

Got lucky on this one. Temperatures and wind chill have moderated the last few days but still its Manitoba in December. It is showing -15C outside with a slight breeze.

Mom and baby look happy and healthy. She had a huge for a Dexter bull calf last January but I had them indoors for that delivery. She made that calf huge while gestating another beautiful calf and keeping herself in good condition as well.

I think this is her sixth calf.

you know what they say it didn't happen if there's no picture.

I will see what I can do.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.n...4aa2441815ab36


https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...b0&oe=550889D1Mom baby and last Januaries bull calf

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...2a&oe=55141F80

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...a0&oe=5513376F
Udders are hardly swollen up at all.

This is the bull calf from about two and a half years ago. She is having a calf at shorter than one year intervals.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...3f78b16ec1f865

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...0c&oe=550336CD

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.n...0b65aa85f589d8

Dad, He is almost nine years old. He only throws black calves. He is only getting mellower with age. He is still dominant over his two and a half year old son. The two and a half year old bull has an appointment with the freezer shortly. We keep our calves intact and always have good beef. Also never have problems with aggression towards humans. Although they know where the tips of their horns are in the occasional internal tiff or if a dog sneaks across the pasture. I bought him as a dehorned two year old.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...28047f141a39aa

Already taking baby on a tour of the facilities. I think I will take them in for the next few nights. And that's probably the reason she is leading the calf away from me and giving me a look over her shoulder. She hates being in the barn.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.n...ae50ed31d1aa7b

I just put mom and baby in the barn. Mom is the alpha cow and gets real antsy when separated from the herd. She gave me a dirty look. But better safe than sorry. Also better if baby is not competing with older brother for milk. This cow almost milked herself to death in her first three lactations. She was letting all three of her first calves nurse.

That's one reason why you wean calves. :facepalm:

If she had three other "calves" nursing her, the cow had little, if any, colostrum for her new calf.

How do you determine who the sire of your calves is?

Oh I am very primitive. No castrating, no weaning, no worming, no antibiotics, no dehorning, no grain, no separation of the bulls.

In this case some years back she stopped nursing three generations. The bulls get eaten by us before they become to much of a problem for the old bull. Excess heifers get sold for hay money.

Something's working for me I eat lots of beef at very little cost and have had zero abortions or dwarfs.

All four cows I am breeding have a different heritage so not to concerned about some genetic mingling.

Sorry, that's not primitive, it's irresponsible.

Cattle are domesticated animals and require some management. Especially Dexters with their inherent genetic defects, you should know "who begat who" if you are selling breeding stock.

Leaving horned "up and coming" bulls in with your dehorned senior bull is a very ugly scene just waiting to happen. Very unfair to the old guy.

That up and coming bull has a very short future ahead of him. He gets to come in for the winter. Just like every one of his male siblings and half siblings before and after him he will end up in our freezer early in the new year.

So I never sell any male offspring. We are a large family and can eat two or three animals a year. In fact some years I have had to slaughter young heifers for meat also.

That leaves the odd heifer for sale. I have not sold them as papered purebred Dexter cattle but simply for the per pound market price of feeder cattle. In fact the only verifiable purebred is the old bull anyway.

Now if they end up on another farm with a different bull and that person is eating the offspring, well that's "Homesteading"

I do not have any short type Dexter cattle because I prefer the larger type
over the "pet" type.

Have never had an abortion or a bulldog in all these years. Never had an aggressive bull, calf, heifer. cow not ever. All cows are super maternal raise fast growing calves on pasture, hay and a mineral salt block.

The meat is great. A few years back the commercial herds around here could hardly be needled enough to keep their feet from rotting off. Not me. Not even once. They do not get foot rot, pink eye, mastitis, nothing.

They do get a few weeks in fall where they get to glut themselves on apple pomace from when I do pressing for folks. I think that may be acting as a natural wormer.

I am not saying that everyone should follow my method and I would sure make adjustments if it becomes necessary.

I am not sure if would even work with other breeds? I have seen four year old dairy bulls that would rather kill me as look at me.

Your Sig says it all.

Ouch. In my defence, I have lots to eat. Give away lots of food also. Oldest three of my seven boys are over six feet tall already. Never wormed them either. They are giving this old "bull" a little trouble but not to bad. Did I mention that Dexters are tough?

How would you rate the growth rate on the just under 11 month old bull calf his moma and new sibling. Anybody look underfed or sickly? https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...b0&oe=550889D1calf

I can not give you an honest answer on the bcs of a Dexter. No one said you were under feeding them and your sons genetics has more to do with there size than eating miniature cattle. The responsibility of proper herd management is what's in question. Being that the new calf did not receive any colostrum because his 3 older brothers/ father /uncle sucked it all is what was being challenged. The calf has an up hill battle. When they start going down hill and they will you will rethink not managing the herd properly. In the wild animals will wean their offspring these are domesticated and require proper husbandry.

This is her sixth or seventh calf. I am going to get it for not being completely sure. Moma and baby are in the barn now and will be for the next few days. I usually do put expectant moms in the barn before they calve and keep them separated from the herd for a few days. She just took me by surprise. Usually she has some discharge for a while before she calves and vulva gets swollen and tendons get soft. I had been watching her but her signs had indicated that she had some time left. Just checked on the pair and everything looks hunky dory? I have had this animal since 2008. at what point will things be going downhill. Some of the dairy guys have a tough time getting four lactations before they have to ship.

Now again I am not recommending that everyone follow my example but how is it possible that this animal is raising beautiful calves, breeding back quickly, gestating beautiful calves again and again if my husbandry is lacking? And its not just this cow. There are three more that produce a beautiful calf on a yearly or less basis. Is anyone indicating that greater efficiencies are available for this small herd. That bull calf is probably almost two thirds his mothers weight at less than 11 months.https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...b0&oe=550889D1?

What nature is capable of, and what is best for the animal, are not always the same thing.

Heifers start cycling a lot younger than they should be bred. Then you have best case scenario a stunted heifer who never reaches her potential. Worst case, a dead heifer and a dead calf, she couldn't deliver it. Leave your herd all running together all the time, sooner or later it happens.

I happen to think that young bulls benefit from the "herd discipline" of a mature bull. Helps them learn their place and not be so "cocky". But a 2 year old isn't a youngster any more! It's just a matter of time before you have a full-on bullfight on your hands. You come out one morning and your old bull is dead or injured, how you gonna feel about that? You have put him at a huge disadvantage by letting the young bulls keep their horns and still keeping them together. Even if he hasn't been injured (yet), he has been harassed and stressed by trying to keep order. In nature, he would run the young bulls off. But you have them fenced in together so that stress is constantly there for him.

You have some decent cattle and in spite of lazy management they have performed well for you. But sooner or later your luck runs out and it's the animal who suffers.

I imagine that me slaughtering the bulls at between the ages of two and two and a half years old performs the function of running the young bulls off? I still think the apple pomace plus other things like pumpkins is acting as a wormer.

I researched the breed before I got into them. Made sure not to get anything that looked like a short leg version. Although a long leg can carry that gene as well. I have never had any short leg calves born in eight years.

I would medicate them if the need arose. So far so good. At some point the girls and bull will get to old and I will have to replace. Dexters are considered a long lived breed and I have grown attached to the old cows and especially the bull. Make sure I stay detached emotionally from the younger stock but they sure are cute when they are young.

Mom and baby doing good in the barn today. Baby nursing, had a good BM and bouncing around happily. She is sure big for a heifer calf. Mom wants out pretty bad though.

https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...6c&oe=550022F7

https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.n...364e32afebd51e
https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.n...bb52d814870aca

I have not noticed the constant harassment you are describing. In fact that two year old bull still defers to his mama.

Most of the head butting is between the calves both male and female. In fact there is more drama between the cows than the bulls.

Of coarse my herd rarely numbers more than a dozen animals so that probably helps. They are not tightly confined at all with multiple off areas to move to. The gate into the pasture is still open if any animal wants to go for a walk about.

For the most part they exhibit a fairly calm family dynamic.

In every photo of your cow where her hind legs are visible, she has them placed forward of a normal standing position. Respectfully suggest you look into that. She might be stiff in the joints, her hooves might be too long in the toe, something. In post 19 it was very noticeable, that made me go back and look at the others again. And I don't see one photo where her hind legs are placed straight under her. Even when she took the calf on walkabout she stopped with both hind legs a little forward. An altered stance would indicate she has pain when she stands "square".

I can most likely assure you the old bull did not the sire of the new calf.
Jr. Was getting free food and free you know what. While that's an acceptable practice in some programs it is not a best practice in keeping replacements. Eventuality your going to keep a heifer or 2 and the inbreeding will cause the herd to regress.

She does show less than ideal conformation. Noticed this when I first bought her as a six month old calf. A little long in the hooves also. Cow hocked and long toed. Not the nicest udder attachments and a funny neck to boot. But for 150 dollars I figured "why not" Also that unfortunate umbilical dohicky she passes on to her offspring. Good grief I just realised she's some ugly cow!! So what! Beef tastes good from ugly cows also. Contemplated cutting the hooves back some but they never got out of hand compared to some skies I had seen on other Dexters. They have a hard gravel road they travel back and forth down the equipment yard/pasture. This seems to help a fair bit so I keep the pasture open till the snow gets deep. They walk back and forth nibbling on the dry grass in the back and around the equipment that was deemed not good enough in the summer months. Doesn't matter if the feeder is full they take a walk at least once a day.

Anyway she does not give any indication that she has any discomfort and will outrun everybody including the calves when I holler with a wheelbarrow full of apple pomace or cull veggies. No creaking or cracking noises one sometimes hears in old cows sometimes either.

I did select for good hooves when bull shopping and it seems to have passed to his offspring but he is a little cow hocked also and has been so from when I got him. But for 600 bucks??? He is slower now then at two years old but will still join in those mad dashes that calves engage in on summer evenings if the mood is right. No limping no noises only has a handful to breed every year and is good with the cows and calves.

I am not sure how many years I can keep the old guy and girls but nice calves keep appearing every year so I leave it for another year.

Since you asked, yes 2 yr bull has a "hunger hollow" and ribs showing. Post #6, 2nd photo. Hope you like lean beef.

He does look lean in that photo. It was early in the morning and belly would have been empty but. hmmm..

He looks different in this shot though. It was taken moments apart though. Wonder what some other breeds would have looked like in the same light?
https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.n...3f78b16ec1f865

\

I haven't seen him mounting any cows but what he does when me and his old man aren't looking??

The old guy has only a handful to service and he follows them around like a puppy the whole time they are receptive. Last summer my sister was visiting and she remarked "He's in love now but what about next week"

How long does a bull remain fertile anyway?

I think that when replacement heifers are going to be kept Ill replace the bull and arrange for the boys to hit freezer camp. There have been a few years where I have got three heifer calves and only one bull calf. Maybe the next time that happens. But I kinda like that old bull. Me and him have hit middle age together.

And your animals do not look bad, we can not all have the show animals. You feed well and sounds like you enjoy them. I would think that is all that really matters.

Thanks for that! I do enjoy having them. This last calf has been prodded and poked the last few days. All this "uphill battle" and whatnot has gotten me all paranoid she's going to up and die on me. She seems pretty round in the belly for something about to expire. She had a nice yellow milk poop this morning so something's going in. Moms getting a little exasperated with me climbing into the pen to check out the baby.

I am somewhat visually impaired and sometimes I miss what others can see. I guess tomorrow that two year old bull going to get felt up to see if he's dying of starvation.

Wow another post about one thing goes off subject and bashing of the person starts!! Your cow and calf look good glad everyones healthy.

You certainly are to be commended for the primitive/natural way you raise your animals. :) It takes a certain type of person to think outside of the box like that, and since it works so well, I'm sure they're benefiting from reduced human attention in those regards.

Thanks but they may have a point. Some breeds would not work under my conditions. I deliberately chose Dexters for this purpose. Also may have got lucky on the extreme mellow temperament of the bull and his offspring. Although I leave things fairly natural the calves are imprinted with human contact from birth. The first few days of their lives while in the barn there is visitation from the kids to see the new baby. The novelty wears off fairly quickly though. And of course I come to feed water the cow three four times a day.

Calf is doing great! Bouncing around kicking legs in the air. Cows udder still not looking extended but I think her little glutton is taking it all. Baby is already mouthing hay. Checked calf's belly and it was round full. Also caught a picture of her taking a good long pee.
https://scontent-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...cc&oe=55461EDB

You might see it as bashing, but for newbies reading these threads, they shouldn't be led to believe that all you have to do is buy some bargain basement cattle, turn them out with zero management, zero health protocols, and everyone just lives happily ever after.

Postroad has dodged a lot of bullets, which he has acknowledged. Many times animals suffer and/or die due to the owner's ignorance and I won't contribute to that.

Reminds of BIL a few years back. They bought a Jersey cow for milking. High production animal, got best hay supplements etc. They got lots of milk and were very happy with it. Second lactation BIL was milking the animal. Darn thing died right there on its feet. BIL said he had to move fast as it was falling on him.
Apparently they being newbies had killed this high production animal with kindness. Forget the details but something about blood calcium levels and rich alfalfa hay?

Also a few years back a local lady rented my bull for her Dexter herd. He stayed there the better part of two months. She brings him back and the bugger is obese. What have you been feeding him I asked. Well he gets rolled grain morning and evening she says.

Long story short, the next year she comes to tell me there is something wrong with my bull. She had a low percentage of her cows get pregnant. I don't know I said. I have four out of four.

Eventually she slaughtered her cows. I know the abattoir operator. He did my beef also. He indicated that he had trimmed in excess of 100 pounds of fat from one cow and thrown it into the bin. She had still gotten less than lean cuts even after this trimming.

Good point Postroad. You can kill with kindness just as well as neglect. But the real killer, the root cause, was the ignorance.

Why does being 'domesticated' equate to being weak and high maintenance?
I am sure if selection was put on 'tough' you would find a lot more herds could be run closer to the environment of Postroad.
My herd is always looked at to be tough and low maintenance. Not that this should equate to neglect. But only the individual herdsman knows what his stock needs.
This goes for any livestock, not just cattle.
You can tell by the photos that his animals are not being neglected. If he can raise good beef with minimal input then 'good for him'

My comments never questioned the health of his herd. I questioned the protocol of not weaning calves and having a 2 yr old bull son with the herd that is going to breed every thing before the old bull gets to it. In the cattle business most try to use a bull that will complement the cow and I think his intentions were there to begin with but not castrating a cross bred bull is asking for trouble. Secondly not allowing a cow to recover and produce the essential colostrum before she calves is not helping the cow. Postroad obviously cares about the welfare of his animals. If this forum only wants feel good comments and no honest discussions I'm in the wrong place. I live in the real world and expect honesty and I give honest assessment. The op can do whatever with my comments it really doesn't matter. I would rather be given a suggestion and something to think about than feelgoodism.

I am wondering exactly how this older cow is maintaining the condition to breed back within six weeks, gestation after gestation?. The calf is thriving as have all previous offspring. What exactly is this calf ingesting from that little udder? She has nice BMs and is peeing regularly.This heifer calf is a solid weight. Wish I had some kind of scale. Last years calf was even bigger. This cow must have a wide pelvis! A few years back I was forking hay into the feeder. The cattle all crowded around. I heard a wet plop. I turned around and she was in the process of turning around to lick the calf dry. Fifteen minutes later that calf was nursing and the cow was munching hay.

Even the other cows usually space their calves a year or more apart. They have the sense to have their calves closer to spring. Probably going to get flamed for this but what the heck. Does anyone else have the phenomenon of cows allowing the younger calves of their herd mates to suckle?

This often happens in spring when two or more cows have calves within a few weeks of each other. Often when on pasture it is not uncommon for there to be two calves on one cow. Later the other cow will return the favour. It seems to be the calves go nurse on whoever is closest.

She is a fertile myrtle, I for one would like all my cows to breed back on the first cycle. Which goes back to my original intent if you want a heifer or two out of her and the only way to make sure it is off the desired bull is to separate or castrate her bull calves. Heifer calves are usually smaller than bulls which is why last year's calf was bigger.

After I commented you edited and added the have the sense to calve closer to spring. They are not refusing to rebreed until a specific time their system is not receptive because of some circumstance like condition ,mineral deficiencies etc. The will cycle they just don't catch until something is corrected.