Horrible Night

springvalley · #21 08/01/12, 10:28 PM

I`m sure she is sore, and as far as jumping on her or tackling her, good luck with that. I have never had a lot of trouble getting close to help a cow or heifer, but I keep them close to the shed when calving most of the time. And some cows take awhile when calving, I don`t get in a big hurry when cows have calves. I will watch them and see how things are going, but some cows take longer. I think you did well for your first calf, I would have you for a neighbor anyday. > Thanks Marc

tinknal · #22 08/02/12, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by springvalley

I always stick a piece of straw,hay or grass up it`s nostrils to get the calf to sneeze and snort so it takes that first breath. There are a lot of tricks to the trade for us old timers, and we love to learn just like the new people do. > Thanks and Blessings > Marc

You should try sticking a chew of snoose up their nose. I've brought them back from the dead!

Kato2010 · #23 08/02/12, 10:00 PM

We calve out about 150 a year. I am so impressed that you got that calf by only pulling with your hands.

This is our protocol, especially with heifers. Early labour we let proceed at it's own pace. Once they get into second stage, where they're actively pushing, we will give them an hour. If we don't see feet, we go in and check it out. Our judgement is that if the calf will come up into the pelvis easily, and we can get a hand over the top of his head, then there is likely room to get him out. If he won't even come up into the pelvis, it's off to the vet clinic for a c-section.

If we do see both feet, she's got to move it significantly within another half hour. If it makes no progress, then we pull. If the feet come out with the soles pointing up, we pull NOW. That's a backward calf, and it needs to come out asap.

To pull a calf, we use a puller, but like others have said, twine will work. The calving chains are put on with a half hitch above the ankle joint, and another one between the ankle and the top of the hoof, along the bottom line of the leg. This spreads the pressure on the leg, and prevents injury. It's possible to have a chain or twine slip and pull a hoof off, or just as bad, break a leg with one loop.

Pull as the cow pushes. At first, pull straight back. As you feel the calf come through the pelvis, angle it more toward her hocks. If you get a hiplock, you can sometimes get it out by pulling the calf between her hind legs angling toward the front of the cow. This gives you leverage.

I think you did really well to get that calf out and save the heifer. I'm sure without your help, they'd have lost the heifer. Maybe you should suggest to them that they get themselves some calving chains and a set of handles.

Good for you. Everyone should have a neighbour that will go the extra mile like you did.

Jessilee7 · #24 08/02/12, 10:42 PM

Thank you Kato.
I guess we may be looking into a calf pulled or at least a pole and twine around for next time.
My only question that I can't seem to answer for myself is: when in pasture with no corral or chute, how do you get close enough to the distressed cow quick enough?
I just know if she'd have let me help sooner the calf would have made it also. After hours of building her trust was when she finally let me get a hand on the calf and she stood still. After that she was pretty good and by the time my hands gave out and I left to get my husband, she was following me and turning her back end to me for help. There has to be a better quicker way though if your cows are calving out in pastures with no working equipment nearby.

Kato2010 · #25 08/03/12, 08:54 AM

Calving in the pasture, that's a problem here too. We don't let any cows go to the summer pasture until they've calved, but not everyone's setup works with that policy. Our late cows stay near home in a smaller pasture, but we still have that same issue you had if there's a problem. If there is a problem we chase the cow back up to the yard. Our other pastures all have a pen we use when we catch them to haul them home in the fall, so that's where anything that needs treating for anything would go.

Portable corral panels work well. We've also been known to use the tried and true "rope dropped over the neck, and then tied to a tree" procedure too. You don't need a horse to rope a cow, especially a fairly quiet one. You just need something solid nearby to tie her to. Once you get the rope on, and have her tied, you can swap it for a halter so you don't have a choking danger. Cows are pretty smart about not fighting a rope, and will often stand for you once you have her in custody.

This is something you'd want to practice, and you wouldn't want to try it on a cow that wants to kill you. ;-)

MDKatie · #26 08/03/12, 09:25 AM

You (figurative you) also should do everything possible to minimize possible problems too, like not breeding heifers so young. It was an accident I'm sure, in this case, but breeding to calving ease bulls and waiting until heifers are mature enough will really help cut down on dystocias.

Also, you can make pretty inexpensive catch pens if you need them...you can use livestock gates to make a small corral and then use another gate inside to make a squeeze area in a corner.

mary,tx · #27 08/03/12, 09:55 AM

I had a similar situation with a small hereford heifer a few years ago. She actually had a big dead calf two years in a row, courtesy of the big-calf-throwing bull in the neighboring pasture.

One year she managed to deliver it herself. The next year I had to pull it.
No, the vet was NOT available to come out. I "put him in a bind" by even asking him.

And you are right. Pulling a calf is NOT like pulling a goat!! It took all the strength I could muster to get that calf out. And, yes, he was beautiful.

After this happened the second year in a row, and the bull was still living in the adjacent pasture, I sent her to the locker, rather than put her through it again.

7thswan · #28 08/03/12, 11:31 AM

Some cows are just not going to let you help. We used to have only Longhorns, they would never let us near. Good thing they are easy calfers,but don't get between them and their calf,ever.

DJ in WA · #29 08/04/12, 07:05 PM

Studies show the obvious - the odds of getting a live calf, and mom breeding back soon, depend on quick intervention.

You're options were pretty limited if there was not advance preparation. Did the owners know she was pregnant? If they did know, facilities should have been set up to be able to deal with the higher likelihood of problems.

I posted about the same situation I had last year. In about March, I realized a British White heifer I bought in November was pregnant. She calved in May at 15 months. After I realized she was pregnant, I halter broke her, and let her jump in the trailer a few times. Called a vet and let him know the situation in advance.

I was hoping for a small calf, but after a half hour of her pushing, and me seeing a big head, she jumped in the trailer and off we went to the vet for possible C-section. He was able to pull the 73 pound bull calf with a calf puller, though not easy. Mom jumped back on trailer even though wobbly in rear end.

She bred back AI first time, and had that calf over a month ago. We'll be eating her first calf in a month or so. A bad situation with some good results.

Then, of course, the other idea is giving lutalyse to abort a young heifer potentially pregnant. Some have been bred as young as 4 months. Lutalyse only works early in pregnancy.

Jessilee7 · #30 08/04/12, 09:33 PM

Kato- Thank you for sharing what you do. I will definately remember that in case there is (and I'm sure sooner or later there will be) a next time.

MDKatie- The neighbor bought three of these heifers as they were being weaned off a nearby farm. He had no idea they were bred. Our neighbor is elderly and admitted that with the 115 degree days we've been having here, that he just hasn't kept a close eye on them. He told us yesterday that he actually believes she is only 13 months old right now, not 15. Even worse I know. Guess people need to pull the bulls out of their pastures as soon as the cows start calving? Around here, every pasture with cows in it also has a bull in it, year round. I am surprised I don't hear of this happening more often I guess.

7thSwan- Longhorns are what I grew up with as well. Out of over 100 head and all the years I remember (I do remember at 3yo watching my parents have to pull a dead horse colt) I never knew of them having to intervene in a longhorn birth. Those babies are just so tiny.
In other recent posts, I've noticed a few people warn to stay away from momma longhorns, which of course is better advice than telling people it's okay, but when I was still young (under 10yo), I would go out and "tame" all the newborn calves almost as soon as they hit the ground.
Paul mentioned how they leave the herd, sometimes for a week or so when calving, and he is right about that. I always felt it was my job to go ride out and find them, get off my horse, check out the calf, play with it a while, then go report my findings. Now that I have a little one of my own, I have really started realizing that maybe my parents did not keep a very good eye on me... lol. I NEVER got hurt doing any of the stupid things I did, but where were they exactly?? Sorry - got off track.

I have a new question about the little cow of this story, but I will ask it in a new thread.
Thank all of you for your advice!

tinknal · #31 08/04/12, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jessilee7

He told us yesterday that he actually believes she is only 13 months old right now, not 15.

Sorry but I just do not believe that this could be possible.

To deliver a full term calf she would have to been bred at 4 months