keeping a bull....tell me what to expect?

Patrick · #41 01/25/12, 09:32 AM

In my experience, if you have to ask if a bull is right for you, you are not ready or do not yet have the proper mindset to keep one safely. I don't know where people get the idea that Dexters are even tempered. True, they can vary like any breed, but often they are like Shetland ponies or many breeds of small dog; selected for small size and "cuteness", but not for temperament. It is a great idea to buy from a breeder who's animals have good temperament, but I can't tell you how many novice cattle owners I've seen who think that they want a Dexter because small size equates with easy handling (in their minds), but who are sorely disappointed.
Oxen are very popular in my area, and every novice 4h kid, or their parents, often want to start out with Dexters, with the same misperception in mind. The only well trained, nonspoiled Dexter teams I've seen are owned by those who have a lot of prior experience training other breeds. Ask most of the knowledgeable, serious ox guys around here, and they will strongly discourage a novice from starting out with Dexters. And don't forget, these are steers we're talking about.
I would take the advice to steer him, and educate yourself about how to go about getting your heifer AI'd. It's not rocket surgery, and in the long run it will be cheaper and safer. If you must, you can always keep a bull once you have more experience dealing with her and the steer.

lakeportfarms · #42 01/25/12, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick

In my experience, if you have to ask if a bull is right for you, you are not ready or do not yet have the proper mindset to keep one safely. I don't know where people get the idea that Dexters are even tempered. True, they can vary like any breed, but often they are like Shetland ponies or many breeds of small dog; selected for small size and "cuteness", but not for temperament. It is a great idea to buy from a breeder who's animals have good temperament, but I can't tell you how many novice cattle owners I've seen who think that they want a Dexter because small size equates with easy handling (in their minds), but who are sorely disappointed.
Oxen are very popular in my area, and every novice 4h kid, or their parents, often want to start out with Dexters, with the same misperception in mind. The only well trained, nonspoiled Dexter teams I've seen are owned by those who have a lot of prior experience training other breeds. Ask most of the knowledgeable, serious ox guys around here, and they will strongly discourage a novice from starting out with Dexters. And don't forget, these are steers we're talking about.
I would take the advice to steer him, and educate yourself about how to go about getting your heifer AI'd. It's not rocket surgery, and in the long run it will be cheaper and safer. If you must, you can always keep a bull once you have more experience dealing with her and the steer.

The key word in here is "novice". Size does play a role in the bull temperament, our 39" high bull can toss 1000 lb. round bales like they are beach balls, but I still tower over him instead of looking eye to eye, and I think that does make a difference in how he responds to me. Oxen also have horns, and I believe the horns lead to a generally more aggressive temperament, steer or not. Yes, too many bad bulls are being kept and breeding cows due to the growing popularity of Dexters, and most cow owners would be better served using AI to a good bull with an excellent temperament.

However, it's hard to quantify bull temperament without physically observing the bull under a variety of conditions, and somebody selecting semen probably has no idea at all other than what is being represented to them. Mean bulls that look great can still be successfully collected and sold, and your resulting offspring could very well inherit those traits. I think Barbados is using sound judgment with her plan, and asking questions or getting an opinion is commendable, so as long as the bull is a good one it should be a good experience.

BarbadosSheep · #43 01/25/12, 12:26 PM

Thank you Lakeport. While new to keeping a bull, I have had some experience with steer in the past, have kept draft horses and have sheep (including rams) now. So I am not new to animal behavior. And I will NOT keep this bull if he turns out to be dangerous. He also won't get to keep his horns. I'll band them off as soon as they are big enough to get a band on them. I will let the heifer keep hers though. I will gentle the bull down enough to be able to handle him but will certainly not make a pet out of him. The woman I am getting these cattle from has a large herd with several bulls in it. Sheep also share the pasture, as do several livestock guardian dogs. Her cattle all seem gentle and have good pedigrees. If things don't work out with the bull I will either transport my heifer a couple hours away for a stay or I'll look into A.I. I sincerely do appreciate all of the input I have gotten here. It helps tremendously.

Carol K · #44 01/25/12, 01:49 PM

Patrick come on over to Western NY, all my Dexters are even tempered, placid, friendly etc. My bull is not halter trained but I can walk up to him, groom him, move him where he needs to be etc. The cows are all able to be groomed, the heifers all come to me, eat out of my hand. I can be in a stall when one calves and handle her calf, so come visit sometime, we'll fix you up with some even tempered ones!

Carol K

Patrick · #45 01/25/12, 03:55 PM

Quote:

The key word in here is "novice". Size does play a role in the bull temperament, our 39" high bull can toss 1000 lb. round bales like they are beach balls, but I still tower over him instead of looking eye to eye, and I think that does make a difference in how he responds to me. Oxen also have horns, and I believe the horns lead to a generally more aggressive temperament, steer or not. True, but that can be addressed by an experienced handler. There are plenty of horned oxen of other breeds which do not have the same reputation as Dexters, and for good reason. Yes, too many bad bulls are being kept and breeding cows due to the growing popularity of Dexters, and most cow owners would be better served using AI to a good bull with an excellent temperament.

However, it's hard to quantify bull temperament without physically observing the bull under a variety of conditions, and somebody selecting semen probably has no idea at all other than what is being represented to them. Mean bulls that look great can still be successfully collected and sold, and your resulting offspring could very well inherit those traits. Very true, but I've yet to hear of anyone, novice or not, being gored by a straw of semen. I think Barbados is using sound judgment with her plan, and asking questions or getting an opinion is commendable, so as long as the bull is a good one it should be a good experience. Agreed, and she's getting various opinions.

Carol, good to know, and I may just keep you in mind because I do like the breed. I did not of course say that they are all bad. In my experience, they have a higher percentage of animals who are, shall we say more tempermental, than other breeds.

fitz · #46 01/27/12, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lakeportfarms

There is a little more to renting out a bull than having him halter broke or with a nose ring. Vaccinations and health testing need to be regularly performed on the bull plus on the cows you expect to service. You don't want your bull coming into contact with a "Typhoid Mary" and subsequently passing it on to your cows or other people's cows.

I agree and that's why I would no more rent/lease out a Bull than I would a piece of equipment. I only buy virgin Bulls @ 14 to 18 months old. He's placed with older, mature cows and quickly becomes acclimated to his new enviroment plus, I don't have to worry about how he is treated by someone else.

fitz