some advise needed for the wife
 

:rock:Ok people im talking the wife into letting me start my own little cattle herd, Basically i will be buying dairy bottle calves to fattin up and sell after a year,
I plan on buying 2-3 every month in a years time.
Why dairy bottle calf's you ask, Well they are more plentifull and cheaper than beef calf's around these parts ( around here they are called a poor mans angus). I will have to drive a 8 hour round trip to get them but im getting a good deal on them from the dairy farmer, 3 :cow: jersey's for $200. All under 2 wks old and have had collustrum.
After a few months he will slip a heifer in every month for future breeders and hand milkers.
I called a local dairy and he will sell me a :cow: for $160, As many as i want to lol so even tho im spending more $ driving i will be getting a better deal.

So i need a few more selling points for the wife so i dont get the :bash: every time i mention it. Any advise or thoughts will be great

Sorry, but I don`t think your going to make very much unless you can get them on pasture for cheep feed. If your buying all your feed your not going to be doing much more than chores for a year. You would also be better off having more calves of a certain size for sales, maybe get a half dozen every other month, instead of 2 0r 3 a month. > Thanks Marc

Driving 8 hours to get 2 or 3 calves per month isn't worth it.

If you get a few to raise and keep one for the freezer, sell the other one or two, you might be okay, but like Marc says, if you're buying all your feed, you won't come out ahead. Wow, driving eight hours to get calves would really put me off buying them. Plus, dairy calves can be hard to raise, especially if you've never done it before. They seem to be pretty delicate for the first few weeks in life and if you don't recognize the warning signs fast enough, they die pretty quickly.

How about starting with two calves to raise and see how it goes? Get your feet wet before you commit to buying more, it should be easier to convince your wife, and you won't have such a large investment of time and money involved getting started.

Oh yeah, if they're Jersey's, you're gonna love the beef! It's awesome.

RW Kansas Hogs - your plan is basically what I do. I am able to buy them direct from a farm about 20 minutes away or worst case from the sale barn about 30 minutes away. I cannot imagine the stress on a young bottle calf having to ride 4 hours one way. We buy ours from $50-$70 each from the farm or $25-$70 from the sale barn, feed them one 50 lb. bag of MR for $65 and 3-4 bags of calf starter at $9/bag. Once they are off of milk, they are given access to pasture. Then after they consume those 3-4 bags of feed they are on pasture only with an occasional handful of grain to keep them tame for any nessecary worming etc. We usually buy 2-3 every few months and now are on our 5th cycle using this method with great success. Our first 2 will be ready for the freezer erly next spring with subsequent animals ready to sell or process every few months from then on. We do have one customer that also buys started calves from us every few months once they are 10-12 weeks old which has helped with cash flow. Our fats are finished on grass and hay with about 10-12 lbs. grain per day the last 45 days. Other that time, I figure between the initial costs ($150-$165), 2 winters of hay ($100), mineral/protein tubs ($75) and grain ($100) our costs come out to about $425for a 1200 lb. animal. All of our steaks were super delicate and even the traditional lesser quality round steak was phenomenal on the grill.
Good luck, it is very nice not to have to buy meat.

The fact is you need to stock up on red ink for the financial ledger. Stick with the wife's plan. JMO Topside

Your wife needs a bigger hammer.

Not worth it, particularly for Jersey bulls.

If the local bulls are Holstein, maybe. MAYBE. You'd definitely be farther ahead paying more locally for Holsteins than travelling that much and overpaying for Jerseys.

Jersey bulls here, 2-3 weeks old, sell at the sales barn for $5. Minimum commission is $5.

those are far from good prices and I wouldn't drive 8 hours to take advantage of them.
Jerseys have no resale value except to certain people, and they would want them at 2 years and all fattened up. A heifer is not the only thing getting "slipped in" with this deal

160 for a dairy bull is a crime as well, they were up that high a few months ago but aren't there at the moment. for 160 I'd expect heifer calves.

I'm also going to have to vote against this deal. That's a long way to haul little dairy calves. And that's a big price for them, imo. They're not going to get all that big, and they're not going to sell for much per pound. I don't know if you could even break even, let alone make money.

I paid $140 each for my little beef heifers. I think I paid $40 for the Holstein steer out front. That was a couple of years ago.

Thanks for everybodys opinion and i will try to answer some questions.
1 $200 for 3 calves is cheap in my area, cattle prices are high where i live
2 They will be put on pasture after they are weaned off the bottle/bucket
3 We have raised bottle calves before
4 I am trying to find them closer to me
5 Cattle prices vary across the country, I would love to pay $10 for a bottle calf but that isnt going to happen where i live
6 The calves will be jerseys & holstiens, Or a cross some sort

If you can find dirt cheap calves in my area please let me know, I am used to driving long distances to get an animal i want. Thats the down fall of living in a small town hours from any major city.

I hope you've read the Sticky on Sale Barn/Bottle Calves. It appears the people who have experience doing this know what they're doing and how to care for these calves properly. Although I've had some experience with cattle, I wouldn't dream of raising bottle calves (and, fortunately, I've not yet had an orphan). I hope you know what you're doing.

Here, you can get bottle calves for $25 a some times of the year and $100 at other times. Check to see if that's what's happening in your area.

I think you can make a go at it...but like Blackwillowfarm said - starts small and see how it works out. 2 calves dying on you can put a damper in your plans. We LOVE jersey beef!

Wish you luck!

By the time you figure gas and time to go get those cheap jerseys you will have doubled their price.
a jersey for 133 that you have to drag all over the country or a holstein for 160 next door is a no brainer (or should be)

Maybe you could convince your wife that the trips out of town to retrieve the little buggers are mini "vacations"! lol

We just bought two bottle Jersey's from a local dairy farm. Had them almost a month now, if I had it to do over again--I wouldn't only for the cost factor. The little bull was two days old, the heifer was a week. MR cost me 42.00 for $25.00 lbs and I have been thru 50lbs already. When you factor in the electrolytes, probios, and any antibiotic you might have to buy. (been dealing with scours), plus feeding twice a day, I could have bought one already weaned for what I have payed in the past month probably. My bull/who is now banded will be going to freezer camp when old enough and the heifer will be our family milk cow. Paid 50.00 for the bull and 200.00 for the heifer. They are eating calf starter and a little bit of hay but are no where near ready to be weaned. Besides the fact you have to be home to feed all the time. I also had to invest in bottles and banding equipment. I probably have at least an xtra 200.00 or more besides their cost, not including my time. By the time they are weaned i will have even more invested.

Just my two cents..lol

Liked your two cents....welcome to the forum...Topside

I wouldn't drive 8 hours for non breeding cattle and that would end it right there if it were the only option. Otherwise I wouldn't mind raising some calves for our own beef, the costs is a factor but just having my own beef at hand is my goal even if it costs a little more. As a business?? Dairy calves are cheap because they don't make meat as efficiently as beef breeds, and since the beef farmers have it tough selling yearlings (been there done that) I'm not sure you could convince me.

Topside, thank you for the Welcome :happy2: I see you are in Monterey Tn, DH and I are located between the "Boro" and Lebanon.

Just wanted to add about the Jersey calves, OP, dont get me wrong I am enjoying raising the bottle calves(except for the feeding and them being so delicate). DH keeps telling me I will have a hard time taking the bull/steer to freezer camp especially since he has a name. :p

I also like the fact that I am raising my heifer, but I just dont see how there is a lot of money to be made in this type of investment. Right now my two are in my foaling stall because they are so little(we have coyotes and yes I have LGDs). I let them out twice a day to run and play in the hallway of my barn. But because they are up that means I not only have to feed them twice a day I have to keep their stall clean. I separate them at feeding time to keep them from sucking on each other after feeding.. then I let them play. So twice a day it takes me at least an hour or 1 1/2 hrs to take care of them. And I work at nights with a full time job. Plus have other farm animals.

The little bull/steer got diarehha right after he started the MR...the heat around here was 100 for a couple of weeks so I had to take care of dehydration, I finally got that cleared up and now the heifer has it...so I am battling it again. So between feedings there is the electrolytes and probios every other day. This has only been in a months time.

I didn't have that much work raising foals for 14 yrs..lol I don't know what your farm situation is so dont know where you would be keeping them...I only had to drive a couple of miles with the calves, I cant even imagine what it would be like on the ones you have to bring back on a long drive. Also you have winter coming on, I also cant imaging raising bottle calves in the middle of winter.

Good Luck with whatever you decide to do, but I think I would make sure I had plenty of customers before I took on that type of responsibilities.. by the way this is my first time raising calves..

I am bottle feeding two little dairy heifers too (a holstein and a jersey/cross). It's my first experience with calves. I bought them from a friend who has a dairy so I felt comfortable with what I purchased. And, I raise dairy goats so my girls are being raised on goat's milk instead of the milk replacer. I battled the scurs the 2nd week and with help from my local cattle friends, got that under control (***fingers crossed***). The girls are 8 weeks now, eating their grain and lov'in the pasture. Unbelievable cute! lol The first month I felt like a new mother....always checking on them, bottle feeding them, making sure they had sense to get out of the rain/heat/etc. Now I am more comfortable. My plan is to keep them, have them breed, then sell. My dairy friend will AI them for me. I've enjoyed having them and have learned a ton!!! I am glad I only got two to start. I'll most likely do it again in the spring....I'm crazy like that. (BTW: Middle TN here as well)

So what's the misses saying now? Decision update based on our comments? Topside

Those jersey bull calves sure do taste good...............but they don't get big enough to slaughter very quick. I prefer jersey or angus/jersey cross beef in my freezer but only under the condition that I have one on grass and one on feed at all times to keep the freezer full.

As I was standing in the dusk, getting eaten by mosquitos, feeding the 2 bottle Holstein bulls, I had an epiphany: Someone here mentioned he fed his milking cow 50 pounds of hay a day, total. Around here this year, that's one bale at $2 each. That's $62/month. A 50 pound sack of MR is $80, and doesn't last a month for 2 calves. It's cheaper to feed a cow who feeds the calves than it is to feed them myself. Except for the price of the cow. And the barn. Sigh. Going off to make up more MR.
Kit

Tim -
We're from NW Kansas too; have you looked at the Maxwell dairy by Atwood, or the Bird City Dairy? Last time I checked (probably a year ago) they were very reasonable and that might be closer for you. Four hours would be really rough on dairy calves under two weeks old. I'm pretty sure the dairy at Bird City uses holsteins, and Maxwells use Jerseys, fwiw.

I second the fact that it'll take a minimum of 18 months, probably closer to 24, to get the bulls ready to process. Just takes longer with those breeds than with meat breeds. Good luck!

Thanks Mom, I didnt even know that there was a dairy over there. I will look up the numbers and let ya know what i find out, I seen an ad on nextech for a beef bottle calf and they want $470 for it. It was a fair bottle calf and won in its class.
I'm all for kids showing animals & 4H, But your not going to get fair prices after the fair is over for any animal.

I milk cows and feed the milk to dairy heifers...I just do not see anything but red in raising bull/steer calfs.. and I raised 150 heifers last year.... I only raise Sept to March...because they are cheap during that time....I do not see making money on heifers when they sell in the $250 to $350 range......Making money is the question..is $50 making money is $200 making money or is $400 making money .... on each calf BOUGHT not sold..I add all price of all calfs add price of all feed all medicine.....then subtract what i get on the sale barn check....that tells you how much you made.....

......I have had people say I bought 4 calves for $100 and 3 died when they sell the one for $400 at 1 1/2 years old they say I made $200 raising calves this year...and I say they went in the whole big time with all the Milk or MR .... feed ....time and grass

From the least qualified person to say anything, I say if it is something that you would get a big kick out of doing, then do it baby:)! Sometimes it is the journey that is so enjoyable, not the destination...But I am a person with an eight year old pet steer, so I have no farm cred....:)

That's the price of BEEF cattle. Dairy cattle, otoh, are cheaper. They always are.
And two month old baby BEEF calves sold at the St. Francis salebarn two days ago for $150. Ie, they're old enough they're probably going to live.

We get our bottle calves free, so our only input costs are MR and calf starter (which they get weaned off when they go to summer grass). Even still, MR was running $80 for a 50# bag this spring. I'm blanking on starter...

If you're determined to get dairy calves, I'd recommend the dairy at Bird, too.

Get your name in at the local salebarns. Hang a sign that says you're looking to buy bum calves.
Which is fine when they're babies, but what about when it's time to market them? Dairy cattle are notoriously difficult to fatten. They just don't flesh out.
And, you won't get as good a price when it's time to sell.

Eh. For something like bottle calves, you're better off where you are. You just need to get to know your neighborhood better.

Have you looked for beef calves?
Ours, for example, come from the feedlot DH works for. Don't get calves from the feedlot itself, though! Any heifers that slipped in that were bred are guaranteed to give birth to a calf that's going to have troubles...
Ours come from the cow-calf side of the operation and no one wants to deal with bums. So they're sent home with whichever one of the guys wants to deal with them. Which, invariably, is us! :D
But we now have a "herd" of five heifers (and a bull). Four of whom were bucket calves. The fifth is the first calf of one of the older ones.

"if it is something that you would get a big kick out of doing, then do it baby! Sometimes it is the journey that is so enjoyable, not the destination"

Amen.

Just for fun, I crunched the numbers for calves a couple of times. I never went through with it though: this is the voice of NO experience!

However, I had to figure which would be cheaper: MR or a dairy cow that would also supply the house with milk? *IF* I had good pasture, the cow looked like a better choice, if only because we use about $6 worth of dairy products per week ($6 x 40 weeks = $240) . I BELIEVE that I figured the sale of her calf would pay for her supplemental feed. If I sold 6 calves off of her a year I would begine to show a profit.... in my area!

The point that I am trying to make is that you need to write down all of your costs. Your costs will be different from mine because I live on the other end of the state. Then look at what the calves would sell for. Figure the benefit of the manure as fertilizer.

Gross - cost= net and a possible profit.

Then show the paperwork to your wife, and she might be MUCH more optimistic!

You should call a local sale barn and ask what dairy steers are selling for - last week here, it was $1.05 per pound. That will give you a better idea if you can make money at this or not. I have a holstein steer that will never, ever make me any money since we spent so much keeping him alive in the beginning - and we had cow milk for him rather than MR. It all depends on how much you will have to spend to get them to size. I have butchered 2 of them - and we shipped them at 16 months so we didn't have to feed them through one more winter. It wouldn't be worth having to buy the hay for the amount of weight they would have gained.

Callieslamb what size were they ?........400 lbs sell here for that $1.00 to $1.05 so thats $400......less what you paid for them.......less hauling both ways even if it is just gas money .... less commission...less Milk or MR...less feed...less death lose...less the price to grow grass......just does not leave much

Is that for dairy calves?
Here, we just sold 400 lb calves for $1.40 last week. Beef calves.

ErinP yes thats what he is talking about raising Dairy calfs